Comments on: an arab for israel. [30 years later] http://www.avantcaire.com/2009/03/26/an-arab-for-israel-30-years-later/ post.arab. Mon, 30 Jan 2012 08:30:00 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: avantcaire http://www.avantcaire.com/2009/03/26/an-arab-for-israel-30-years-later/comment-page-1/#comment-144 avantcaire Wed, 29 Apr 2009 21:19:17 +0000 http://www.avantcaire.com/?p=778#comment-144 thank you for adding your voice ahmed. <br><br>i am in agreement with your thoughts and sentiments. i especially appreciate your view on how things can move from idealism to realism with surprising speed.<br>there is of course plenty of work to be done on both sides of the wall. an important part of that work is chipping away at the prejudices and mis- (or non-) understandings of each other. here's to moving beyond the mutual vilification. thank you for adding your voice ahmed.

i am in agreement with your thoughts and sentiments. i especially appreciate your view on how things can move from idealism to realism with surprising speed.
there is of course plenty of work to be done on both sides of the wall. an important part of that work is chipping away at the prejudices and mis- (or non-) understandings of each other. here's to moving beyond the mutual vilification.

]]> By: avantcaire http://www.avantcaire.com/2009/03/26/an-arab-for-israel-30-years-later/comment-page-1/#comment-75 avantcaire Wed, 29 Apr 2009 17:19:17 +0000 http://www.avantcaire.com/?p=778#comment-75 thank you for adding your voice ahmed. <br><br>i am in agreement with your thoughts and sentiments. i especially appreciate your view on how things can move from idealism to realism with surprising speed.<br>there is of course plenty of work to be done on both sides of the wall. an important part of that work is chipping away at the prejudices and mis- (or non-) understandings of each other. here's to moving beyond the mutual vilification. thank you for adding your voice ahmed.

i am in agreement with your thoughts and sentiments. i especially appreciate your view on how things can move from idealism to realism with surprising speed.
there is of course plenty of work to be done on both sides of the wall. an important part of that work is chipping away at the prejudices and mis- (or non-) understandings of each other. here's to moving beyond the mutual vilification.

]]> By: Ahmed http://www.avantcaire.com/2009/03/26/an-arab-for-israel-30-years-later/comment-page-1/#comment-74 Ahmed Tue, 28 Apr 2009 22:14:55 +0000 http://www.avantcaire.com/?p=778#comment-74 I am with avantcaire and believe in a peaceful existence of Israel. There's a lot of work on required from both sides to make this possible. The xenophobia runs extremely high on both the Israeli and the Arab sides. <br>In response to Eman's reply, I say that peaceful and respectful coexistence doesn't have to come at the price of turning a blind eye to the crimes that were committed (by both sides). We must reconcile our past issues before we're able to move forward (this includes the Right of Return, etc.). As idealistic as this may sound today, it is not that far fetched; look at the State of Israel and Germany as a good example of reconciliation. <br>In all cases, Coptic, Muslim, Jew, Armenian, Durzi, etc. etc. our region is full of rich heritages and we must learn to live and learn from each other. It's a unfair to say that all the work has to be done from the Arab side; I just read the results of a survey about the Israeli's attitude/ perception of Arabs and they were quite negative. Both sides have to learn more about each other and seek out their similarities and common grounds. <br>Ahmed I am with avantcaire and believe in a peaceful existence of Israel. There's a lot of work on required from both sides to make this possible. The xenophobia runs extremely high on both the Israeli and the Arab sides.
In response to Eman's reply, I say that peaceful and respectful coexistence doesn't have to come at the price of turning a blind eye to the crimes that were committed (by both sides). We must reconcile our past issues before we're able to move forward (this includes the Right of Return, etc.). As idealistic as this may sound today, it is not that far fetched; look at the State of Israel and Germany as a good example of reconciliation.
In all cases, Coptic, Muslim, Jew, Armenian, Durzi, etc. etc. our region is full of rich heritages and we must learn to live and learn from each other. It's a unfair to say that all the work has to be done from the Arab side; I just read the results of a survey about the Israeli's attitude/ perception of Arabs and they were quite negative. Both sides have to learn more about each other and seek out their similarities and common grounds.
Ahmed

]]> By: avantcaire http://www.avantcaire.com/2009/03/26/an-arab-for-israel-30-years-later/comment-page-1/#comment-71 avantcaire Fri, 10 Apr 2009 13:32:28 +0000 http://www.avantcaire.com/?p=778#comment-71 yes ahmed - my point is focus on the future rather than settling the past. alleviating the hopeless state of palestine's refugees seems much more pressing than arguing over precise land borders.<br><br>eman - the recent gaza war was not israel's finest hour. perspective is in order though. most countries tend malicious- israel's unchecked regional dominance doesn't help. no such thing as a country with a clean slate. i have heard the 'someone moves in to your house' line often - but that episode is over. as part of the post 48, post 67 generation the goalposts have shifted from reclaiming palestine to reclaiming palestinian self-determination alongside the region's new superpower. what is important to me is dealing with the refugees, building a peaceful prosperous gaza etc.<br>my post was less a brag of love for israel than a call for more vocal arab support for peaceful coexistence - and i welcome your voice.<br><br>forsoothsayer- glad to see you've traitorously fallen in line. i also support your right to an obedient second-class citizenship. yes ahmed – my point is focus on the future rather than settling the past. alleviating the hopeless state of palestine's refugees seems much more pressing than arguing over precise land borders.

eman – the recent gaza war was not israel's finest hour. perspective is in order though. most countries tend malicious- israel's unchecked regional dominance doesn't help. no such thing as a country with a clean slate. i have heard the 'someone moves in to your house' line often – but that episode is over. as part of the post 48, post 67 generation the goalposts have shifted from reclaiming palestine to reclaiming palestinian self-determination alongside the region's new superpower. what is important to me is dealing with the refugees, building a peaceful prosperous gaza etc.
my post was less a brag of love for israel than a call for more vocal arab support for peaceful coexistence – and i welcome your voice.

forsoothsayer- glad to see you've traitorously fallen in line. i also support your right to an obedient second-class citizenship.

]]> By: str82ais http://www.avantcaire.com/2009/03/26/an-arab-for-israel-30-years-later/comment-page-1/#comment-68 str82ais Thu, 26 Mar 2009 21:00:32 +0000 http://www.avantcaire.com/?p=778#comment-68 These days I'm under the influence of your Naipaul quote "the past has to be seen to be dead; or the past will kill." <br><br>I'm also under the influence of "who moved my cheese?" the story of two humans and two mice who feed off a giant piece of cheese. One day, the cheese's gone, the mice immediately scurry away looking for new fortunes, but the humans go: "who moved MY cheese".<br><br>So, yeah, hey, Israel is reality and the Palestinians should move on, and the Arabs and the sympathisers and everybody else. The Palestine of past has to be seen as dead or, bloody hell, it will phosphor-bomb kill you. Those who moan about Israel should stop saying "who occupied MY Palestine" and scurry off chasing new dreams.<br><br>Does the above look right to you? These days I'm under the influence of your Naipaul quote “the past has to be seen to be dead; or the past will kill.”

I'm also under the influence of “who moved my cheese?” the story of two humans and two mice who feed off a giant piece of cheese. One day, the cheese's gone, the mice immediately scurry away looking for new fortunes, but the humans go: “who moved MY cheese”.

So, yeah, hey, Israel is reality and the Palestinians should move on, and the Arabs and the sympathisers and everybody else. The Palestine of past has to be seen as dead or, bloody hell, it will phosphor-bomb kill you. Those who moan about Israel should stop saying “who occupied MY Palestine” and scurry off chasing new dreams.

Does the above look right to you?

]]> By: Eman http://www.avantcaire.com/2009/03/26/an-arab-for-israel-30-years-later/comment-page-1/#comment-67 Eman Thu, 26 Mar 2009 16:18:11 +0000 http://www.avantcaire.com/?p=778#comment-67 So, someone takes your house and force you to leave. He then beautifies your house, treats his family better than you used to treat yours in the very same house you used to live in! So, this someone deserves your respect! hmmm no don't think so. it seems you picked and chose few things you like here and there and based your judgement on these things. Yes, we are oppressed in the arab world, yes, our governments do not believe in transparency and they're all are shit, and so on and so forth.. however, our bad doesn't make israel a less malicious state! <br><br>In the arab world there are people who believe in the co-existence and i'm one of those just as theJewish/Israeli leftist do. . <br><br>in your post, you kinda state your very very personal reasons that dictated your support to israel and which makes your post a very opinionated piece of writing (not that you claimed objectivity!) what hurts however is that you're bragging about your love to israel two months after Gaza war! it seems like you were completely out of touch when it happned and no one told you about it. here's a link to help you out: <a href="http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/series/gaza-war-crimes-investigation" rel="nofollow">http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/series/gaza-war...</a> So, someone takes your house and force you to leave. He then beautifies your house, treats his family better than you used to treat yours in the very same house you used to live in! So, this someone deserves your respect! hmmm no don't think so. it seems you picked and chose few things you like here and there and based your judgement on these things. Yes, we are oppressed in the arab world, yes, our governments do not believe in transparency and they're all are shit, and so on and so forth.. however, our bad doesn't make israel a less malicious state!

In the arab world there are people who believe in the co-existence and i'm one of those just as theJewish/Israeli leftist do. .

in your post, you kinda state your very very personal reasons that dictated your support to israel and which makes your post a very opinionated piece of writing (not that you claimed objectivity!) what hurts however is that you're bragging about your love to israel two months after Gaza war! it seems like you were completely out of touch when it happned and no one told you about it. here's a link to help you out: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/series/gaza-war…

]]> By: forsoothsayer http://www.avantcaire.com/2009/03/26/an-arab-for-israel-30-years-later/comment-page-1/#comment-525 forsoothsayer Thu, 26 Mar 2009 09:55:00 +0000 http://www.avantcaire.com/?p=778#comment-525 i have no problem with them existing peacefully either. but obviously my opinion doesn't count as a coptic traitor. i have no problem with them existing peacefully either. but obviously my opinion doesn’t count as a coptic traitor.

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